Musician: Hey Apple, I just had to accept a new license agreement for your iTunes platform.
Apple: So what? You have been really reading through it?
Musician: It says that I have to use GarageBand if I want to see any music I produce on iTunes.
Apple: Correct.
Musician: Well but I do not like GarageBand. I would like to use Ableton Live.
Apple: Sorry but you are not allowed to use that.
Musician: But it is suited very well for electronic music.
Apple: Use GarageBand then. It is a magical and amazing product!
Musician: Okay fair enough, but what if I would like to play the piano? An instrument I have practiced since more than eight years. I think I am creating better music on a piano than with GarageBand.
Apple: Then you invested your time in the wrong instrument.
Musician: Okay. What about the Audiotool? Can I use it?
Apple: That application does not even run on our devices. Those developers are lazy.
Musician: Errr, okay. So if I use GarageBand I can do what I want?
Apple: No. If you use the F-word in a song for example it won’t be distributed via iTunes.
Musician: You are kidding. Why?
Apple: Because we think that it is not appropriate.
Musician: That must be a joke.
Apple: Not at all. Your child could listen to that song — think about it.
Musician: Well, I think I know best what’s good for my child. Besides, would some parental control system not help here?
Apple: Next question please.
Musician: Okay, assume I use GarageBand and that my content is “appropriate”. Can I be sure it will make it to the iTunes store?
Apple: First we will check it.
Musician: How long will that take?
Apple: Up to two months.
Musician: Are you serious?
Apple: Yes. There is plenty of music being created and we want to filter only whats best for our users.
Musician: And you think you can decide that?
Apple: Sure.
Musician: Okay, let me sum this up quickly: I have to use GarageBand to create any music for iTunes. It has to be “appropriate” and then you let me wait for quite some time to tell me whether you like it or not?
Apple: Now you make it sound like as if we were evil. Google is evil. We are the good guys! And look, the new iPad. Isn’t it beautiful?
Musician: Oh, yeah. I really want that overpriced product. Where can I buy it?
Apple: In our certified Apple retail stores.
Musician: And you will not pull me over this time like you did with the iPhone when you dropped the price dramatically two weeks after its release?
Apple: No. Not exactly. We will release an iPad with a webcam soon. And we will charge $200 extra for that.
[...]
Sounds strange doesn’t it? Thank god this was just a fictional interview and will never become reality.
62 Comments
I think you should change the part that says
Musician: Okay. What about the Audiotool? Can I use it?
Apple: That application does not even run on our devices. Those developers are lazy.
With
Musician: Okay. What about the Audiotool? Can I use it?
Apple: That application does not even run on our devices. They want it to, but we won’t let it because we’re childish a_____es and are throwing a hissy fit because the company that makes it are cooler than we are. They did manage to get a version of their app working, too, but we shot it down in our licensing and crushed a bunch of other companies in the process. Plus, did I mention those developers are lazy?
“Musician: Oh, yeah. I really want that overpriced product. Where can I buy it?
Apple: In our certified Apple retail stores.”
I doint think 499 is overpriced for what you get. And you doint have to buy it in a certified Apple Store. Best Buy got some too.
Despite this, Im with you.
You forgot to mention that the musician will of course have to use Final Cut Studio for his music videos.
Is this serious?
Great ‘fictional’ interview.. the reality viewed from another point!
Is there a copy of this agreement anywhere online?
Also, which version of iTunes does this refer to?
When does the boycott campaign begin?
Kosso: this is not real. You might want to read the post on daringfireball about Apple and their change to the license agreement for the iPhone OS SDK to put this in context.
If you don’t like it and I’m with you on Apple’s ever increasing methods of forcing people to things their way then go elsewhere. It’s not like there aren’t other options, you can still use the Macbooks etc with other OS’s. And if you want an oversized iPhone then go ahead and buy one; at least you’ll know it’s going to really govern how you use the web.
Apple seem to be moving more into this way of thinking which is odd when Microsoft after years of doing this have now realised it’s stupid to do so and have relented! Could be an interesting few years to see how things play out with Apple….
I’m done with Apple, I have a gut feeling they’re going to become a toy manufacturer again, like the 80′s – 90′s
Amazing, I was just thinking about this and trying to figure out what the end goal is for Apple. As time goes on, fewer people will use their product because they will inevitably get more and more restrictive. It’s a shame because they do make nice products, but oh well. Android here I come!!
Ok Joa, I know you won´t allow my post to be published but I want you to know that i´m silently expressing what most of our flash community are feeling right now :
*CENSORED*
@Steve Jobs: computers are supposed to be tools of creativity and inspiration, not Stalinesque expel-only media troughs.
Apple used to be hippy-chic and creative and special; now they are suppressive, isolationist and consumption-oriented (though they are still doing it in creative ways). Shocking, and very sad.
How have I reacted to this continuing down-turn in openness and respect for the creative community? I own a shiny new MacBook that now runs Windows 7 almost exclusively. Am I happy about it? Not one bit.
While I do think it’s a problem that Apple is actively blocking things like CS5 iPhone export and MonoTouch because I believe that they will never be truly successful against native CocoaTouch apps, I think that Flash programmers need to understand that using Flash for everything is poor practice. If Adobe put out a web server platform that ran AS3, would you use that instead of PHP or Rails for your backend processing? Would you use AS3 to build a high-performance 3D game? No you wouldn’t – you would use the correct programming language and framework to give the user the best experience possible, be that Ruby, PHP, Python, C, Javascript, or Objective-C.
The only type of application which should be outside this rule is a game, because native cocoa touch controls don’t necessarily damage the experience. However, unless Adobe is willing to release updates to their iPhone export tool on Apple’s schedule, no exported Flash game is going to support the new gaming social networking APIs before CS6, whenever that arrives. And background suspend and resume of your game? Tough luck, wait until CS6.
At this point the question is somewhat moot because Users don’t care about all this scrabbling. If you want your app to be popular, you’re just going to have to bite the bullet and port it. Personally, I think that this will benefit the iPhone software ecosystem, but I wish Apple had gone about this a different way.
Beautifully written. Tragically close to home.
@Stephan
I’m pretty sure Adobe is putting out an ActionScript3 back-end using their ColdFusion server platform in the next few months.
And Adobe will have more than enough time to update their CS5 toolset based on the beta Apple SDKs. No need to wait for a major release of CS or for Apple to release the next version.
This whole thing is just getting ugly. And now it’s not just Adobe they are targetting. Smaller middleware devs like Appcelerator, Torque and Unity are going to be hit with this clause as well. It’s their device & platform though. They are completely legally allowed to set the limitations on its use.
I think the author and the flash devs who agree are selfishly angry. They think this is a move to block them and make things harder for THEM but it’s not about being childish. It’s about a track record, mobile development and maintaining the reputation of the app ecosystem.
Track Record. I (and many of my mac cohorts) have seen Flash spike CPU on brand new hardware with fast processors and 8GB RAM so how will my poor little iPhone perform? Sure there is an argument that enabling flash on the devices reduces the demand for native apps but hybrid apps and jQuery are all options now but the native apps continue to flourish.
Mobile Development. How big is your SWF? For every flash developer who knows that an optimized lightweight SWF loads faster there are hundreds who build and deploy massive SWF files that take a lot longer to load even on broadband, let alone filtering that through AT&T’s “reliable” network. From a user experience if I wander onto a page with a bloated flash movie I risk crashing my device or at least locking up my bandwidth.
Code generation. I’ve been a ColdFusion developer for over 10 years and have written code generation apps from scratch but always with the understanding it gets me 80% of the way there even when I’m generating ColdFusion apps! Imagine the idea of trying to write codegen in one language for another?! If the developers using the generated code don’t learn Objective C it puts pressure on the review process. Just to correct the point in the blog post – review time is less than a week and has been for some time with my record turnaround at 3 days recently. Starting with this 80% code developers either never submit because they can’t get it working or do submit it and have multiple app rejections because they don’t understand why it breaks. A plethora of CS5 generated apps could therefore put a huge strain on the review resources based on these multiple rejections. Even if an app sneaks through the likelyhood of an app continuing to crash would threaten the reputation of the developer and the app store.
A solution. I think that if Adobe would be willing to sponsor the addition of a team of Apple Appstore reviewers dedicated to apps built with Adobe’s codegen tools the situation would be very different. It’s easy for Adobe to say their tools would be perfect but until they pay the salaries of the review team it’s hard to accept responsibility for the consequences of their actions.
WTF
IS DIS REAL
The funny thing is how different the implementations of the AppStore and the iTunes store were.
The iTunes store greatly opened the market for musicians — suddenly, anyone could sell music.
The AppStore is all about control: Apple wants to control everything related to it.
@joa :)
Heh. Gotcha!
I few minutes after reading this, I realised it was a ‘go’ at the Apple iPhone OS 4.0 Section 3.3.1 nonsense ;)
You had me going for a bit! (needs more coffee)
I have to agree with Stephen above me. Use the right tools for the right project. Well said!
Apple has never been loose about its design and development (except maybe in the dark days when Jobs was not there). They have always had incredibly tight control over there products. The difference now is that we get to see it effect a growing external developer community.
Stephen,
Your analogy makes sense, but I don’t think it applies to this case. Being able to select the right tool for the job requires the freedom to select your tool at all.
Uh, no. If this is supposed to be a clever analogy about flash, it fails to convince me. When I play music which was created by Ableton Live, it does not kill the battery life of my portable music player.
I might be a lot more sympathetic about flash if it weren’t for the fact that so many of the crashes I have with web browsers on personal computers are on flash-heavy web pages. Some flash-based web sites are very very nice, I will admit. But others use flash for no real benefit, except to greatly increase the probability that my web browser will start using 50% of my CPU — even when I’m not doing anything in that browser.
(note: I’m also the kind of guy who avoids most of the really cool plug-ins for web browsers, because I’d rather have a web browser that will remain running for a week or two without crashing).
If we’re going to ban inefficient code that’s the product of a poor cross-platform porting framework and results in a goddamn awful app, Apple could have the decency to ban their own Windows port of iTunes.
(let me add that I realize Apple’s actions here will effect more than Flash, and that will probably include some very nice options which would be a win for iPhone/iPad users. But if this is about flash, then I’m not all that sympathetic. The guys who do write excellent web pages in flash are very likely quite capable of writing even better iPhone/iPad apps without using flash. IMO. YMMV. Etc).
I really don’t care whether or not Apple likes Flash, its not the point of theoretical conversation. The problem is Apple is creating conflict on every level of their business. They’re not a friendly or hippie-chic club; they’re manipulative and greedy. More people need to stop being apologists. BOYCOTT
You forgot that they will charge you $99 a year to publish your music
Did I mention Flash in this blog post? I do not think so.
shutup stephen . Flash ruiles and will rule as always.
I guess the point is: Apple is asking developers to invest time and money in their platform using a work flow that they dictate. This could still be reasonable if it weren’t for Apple constantly changing the rules all the time and sometimes without warning.
It may technically be a great platform, but from a business perspective, it’s becoming more and more unreliable. There are no guarantees that what you create will make it to the store, when it will make it to the store and if it will stay in the store and on user gadgets.
Adam Howitt,
The best thing Adobe can do is to stop writing software for macs. After that, the macs are worth the shit.
Great post. Lee McColl Sylvester’s comment is also hilarious.
To those of you who think this is all about Flash: Apple’s new policy affects a lot more than just Flash. It affects any kind of code generator. There are many programming problems where it makes sense to use a domain specific language. Many developers would rather use some language other than C/Objective-C/C++. There are even legacy libraries developed in other languages (eg: many scientific and numerical libraries are written in Fortran). All of those are now officially forbidden for iPhone/iPad apps. (I suspect the legacy library issue is actually why C and C++ were included as allowed — there’s way too much useful legacy code in C and C++ to ask people to rewrite it.)
Using the analogy of this post: you might not like the way kazoos sound. They aren’t banning just kazoos, though. They’re banning all ways of producing music other than GarageBand.
Bullcrap.
Where did it say you HAVE to develop for the iPhone and iPad? Or to keep with your stupid analogy, would Apple FORCE you to sell your music on iTunes?
Quit the whining already! Go work on other platforms, the world is big enough.
The article sums up the current situation.
I use a Apple MacBook, and yes, I had a iPhone 3G. It wasn’t my cup of tea; So I jailbroke it. Despite that, not supporting 900Mhz 3G Wireless Band is a no-no for a young Web Developer that swears by
Apple really limits what you can do on their devices. Okay, yes I have a MacBook, and it runs Windows 32bit and 64bit fine – however, I go to install Ubuntu and I have to run around installing packages and all other crap. So much for the “just works” motto.
Apple is trying to cram shit down developers’ and musicians’ throats, of course we’ll rebel and give them the finger. I assume many developers will turn to Windows Mobile, WebOS (Palm) or even Android for publishing music and whatnot.
Could we have a DroidBox for downloading new music that rivals the iTunes Store on Android devices, in native MP3 format? Possibly.
If I was the CEO at apple, I would really take the head of apple and turn it around. To me, it seems like it’s a one-way ticket to doom and torture being on a restricted platform.
No one respects programmers or software freedoms til they don’t have any. Stop using this incredibly proprietary garbage.
Apple hates your freedom, show them the door.
Jailbreaking is against the law, it isn’t a solution. Your only solution is to invest in products which respect your freedom.
Flash = bad.
Closing down other measures to create apps, like Unity3D, Appcelerator, etc = bad Apple.
To those that says Flash is bad, I agree with you. But what Apple did just affect other platform than Flash as well. They just brought everyone else into the fight.
Expect games titles to lessen, and the price to go up as everyone will have to create a game engine themselves in order to create games. Of course we know quality will go up when everyone is creating their own game engine, even though its not their speciality. Right? And I am not talking about the monstrosity called Flash here.
Its Apple vs Adobe. But their hurting developers as well, not that anyone would care anyway.
What this is about is Apple preventing the platform to become commoditized. Its not about preventing bad apps. Heck, they screen that. Its not about increasing better user experience. Bad developers can still write bad codes not matter what language.
Its all about Apple’s bottom line. Those who drinks the cool aids can sing any tunes they like, but its never about the users.
What Apple wants is to keep the users to keep buying from them. Good experience matters, but its not everything. When you can develop apps for iPhone and can simply port it to another platform, then users may go to other platform as well, and not buy stuff from Apple.
In the end, again, its not giving the customer the best experience. It is just about Apple.
Im going to have to side with Apple on this, while Apples stranglehold on what content they deem acceptable is deeply troubling it does make a good deal of sense for the iPhone/iPad which is closer in ecosystem to a games console rather than a PC and people should think of it as such in most regards.
Oh and I work in Flash so *gulp* time for me to adapt and change like a big boy, insects specialize
Fadzlan, what do you know about flash and why is it a monstrosity?
BAR OWNER: Hey everybody, i just opened an amazing bar! come see it!
VISITOR: Hey, this bar is cool! but maybe you should move the toilets to where the smoking area is, it will be more convenient for me, since i like to smoke when i go to the restroom.
BAR OWNER: Hmm… let me think… nope.
VISITOR: Come on, move the toilets!
BAR OWNER: No. This is my bar, you don’t have to come here you know.
VISITOR: Toilets & smoking area now! you are a tyrant!
BAR OWNER(TO SECURITY): Please remove this dude from my place.
The writer is a Sr flash developer and iPhone developer who thinks anti-apple flash developers are being really childish.
Good stuff, quite funny. Had to laugh a couple of times while reading..
Cheers to the lazy guys. :)
First of all… How exactly does this all mean that Flash developers are lazier than anybother type of developer? Secondly, some might argue that laziness is one of the virtues of a good programmer (http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Larry_Wall)
If there are any programmers out there that don’t try to achieve the best results with least effort, I would like to know why they think doing it the hard way is better.
@Adam H. – you may want to take a moment to understand what the iPhone packager does before basing you whole argument on the fact that code generation tools don’t give the same result as apps written by hand. If you had, you would know that the iPhone packager is NOT a code generation tool. (if it was generating Objective-C, then the new clause in Apple’s agreement wouldn’t be a problem). It compiles directly to the byte code just like Objective-C would.
Also all the arguments about how Flash spikes the CPU on new equipment are all moot. The iPhone packager doesn’t put Flash Player on the device. Flash player has nothing to do with it once it is compiled.
great :)
it’s time to open the eyes to see the real picture of Apple …
yes, I have an iphone, and I like it,
but I would like it much more if Apple wouldn’t be so restrictive!
I planned to buy a new one this summer,
but I think I will not support this any longer …
Straw man argumant. Your logic is fallacious.
@Stephen
I think you’re confusing a language with its target platform. I could write an Obj-C compiler that output to Flash natively, just as I could write an AS3 compiler that output ASM. The language is merely the syntactical preference of the compiler writer. The Objective-C compiler writer, ergo, is a weird maniacal nutcase on dope with a chip on his shoulder and a plan to piss people off or make them go nuts. Whichever comes first.
Oh, and his name is Steve Jobs…
Apple politcs just show that they dont respect the enviroment of developers – by many languages – wich, must of then, had filled their pocket with money. And this apple’s authoritarian way of conduct their business will probably knock out them one day.
Remember: the discussion is not about Adobe vs Apple. The discussion is about Flash, C# .NET, Unity, Ruby, etc etc, DEVELOPERS. And, come on, there is no “bad Flash” or “allways good JavaScript” products. There is bad developers and good developers. There is a lot of websites with so many Javascript throwing exceptions that NY has in cars. To keep the ‘good performance’ of the apps they dont need to exclude all ‘No C-Objective’ developers from the game.
The ‘nice and cool soul’ of Apple was builded with the help of many developers who like, use and recommends Apple’s products, not because Steve Jobs is a nice dude. Btws, he isnt. Apple is kicking out a very considerable number of important minds in global developers enviroment. And this all situation is just big and pure greed. Shame on Apple!
Don’t like it, use something else. Getting sick of the whiners!
Proudly posted from my iPhone.
I am a flash developer/designer and apple lover… I was considering moving from pc to mac… But what next from apple, if you develop on a mac you can’t develop for any other platform. This has put a serious dent in my apreciation,as a whole, for apple and it’s direction in the future. Whether it be a design machine, my next phone or if I even buy the ipad… Adobe and apple have worked fine for so long why can’t they come together and both make flash work for the better of the web. Comes on guys let’s all play nice.
I’ve never been a huge fan of flash games and I am an artist/developer, but for the past year I have been using Unity and unfortunately this truly is sad to see them blatently alienate this platform.
Hey Steve thanks for putting educated engineers that have supported and looked up to you for years out of business during a recession. What goes around comes around. I’m not down and out because I have never placed all my eggs in one basket but others I know have.
Steve Jobs is a frigging jackass thats trying to sell units. Don’t buy into the rest of these PR stunts and lets let steve be the one thats looking for a job. I find some irony that all his devices start with “I” and his last name is jobs.
The part I don’t get is why people are so surprised that Apple is acting this way.
Developers Are Divas: http://bit.ly/bJ35G8
Yes, shoot all the developers in the foot and run your race alone, then the only place left is the first place, since there is no one other running with you! Good idea Apple.
But they soon will realize, this will make them only weaker and fortunately, nature takes care of the weak ones so only strongest will survive.
well, well, about lazyness in development … there’s lazy instantiation … is it bad ?
Ok, jokes apart,
@Pedro Paulo Almeida you’re right! there’s good and bad programming and it doesn’t mean flash is bad it means you have to do it right … like joa said on another post, optimise optimise optimise we’ve been thaught to do just that with flash.
@Adam Howitt, man are you serious ? do you work for Apple come on! if you did your research right you’d know that Apple has been blocking access to the low level apis to Adobe while the flash players works “better” in windows and takes advantage of the cpu, etc …, without those apis in Apple environment it can really be comparable ( check the post about it on Mike Chambers’blog ) and by the way it’s not just flash Apple is targeting with this campaign though i have to agree that yes it’s their ecosystem they might as well do anything they please with it and be called tyranical in nature.
General idea here … I want to develop in the IDE I choose, the way I think it’s best so the developer should be in control not the other way around,
first thing if Apple blocks my development fine … i move to another environment period ( like someone said the world is large enough )!
second thing stop flaming about Apple vs Adobe, or at least if you like flaming flame about everything this isn’t an Apple vs Adobe exclusive.
third, really … do you think Adobe’s business line is only iphone development ? last time i checked it wasn’t i recommend http://www.adobe.com go read!
fourth, adobe isn’t lazy, developers sometimes are, what did you want to create ? before iphone mobile sucked big time now that it came everyone’s cannons are aiming at Adobe for being lazy, mobile was lazy Adobe just delivered the means for the mobile development comunity it’s not Adobe’s fault, when they wanted to jump on the iphone bandwagon to deliver again they had the door shut on their face!
Fifth, Objective-c is just nextsteps implementation that Apple bought so what ? by the way did i mention Objective-C is slow ? there’s plenty of reference to that on the web just research.
For all of the people who are saying us flash devs are being sucks etc… please get a life. There is absolutely nothing wrong with using flash to develop applications as you can see from the success of things like Adobe AIR. You’ve been brainwashed by Apple to believe the bs that they are selling for the sake of protecting their stakehold in the copious amounts of money that flow through thier nazi-germany style camp gates.. errr… itunes. If flash sucks or “isn’t good enough” because of it’s internal design then I guess C#/Java… uhh to make it short pretty much anything but C/C++/ObjectiveC sucks and we should all just become some form of C developer. Geeze yeah now that I think about it as I write this post I mean, what a whining baby loser I am for having the ability to publish my content with a single click to nearly any platform except iNazi based devices. I should just really re-think my entire life/career choices all because I am an idiot for spending years mastering a language that one man who has been nothing but a jealous underdog (and a failure at it, at that) feels is “stupid” or “crappy” because by chance he caught a market niche and suddenly thinks he is god of all things computer related including development. Yeah… man wow I feel stupid now having even written anything about this. I better quit my full time job as a flash dev and invest all of my time learning a language specifically for a single closed platform that is under the reign of an uber jealous superiority complex plagued closet nazi, consequently hanging my life and future (as far as feeding my kids, keeping a roof over their head and the very substance of my career) in his hands.
Why do people mention SWFs, Flash performance, websites, etc? What does that have to do with blocking developers from using other DEV tools that export to IPhone apps?
(People commenting here, that is)
hehehe I LOVE IT. all this talk reminds me of when Apple bought Emagic in 2002 and i lost the uses of Logic Audio for my home studio setup running Windows just to get down quick ideas to take over to main sutdio so just switched to digidesign Protools full time on both mac and win.
Loved it! So true… the situation all creatives find themselves in today… and if we are not careful it will even be more prominent tomorrow.
And you are not allowed sell open source software on IPhone.
http://www.maclife.com/article/news/apple_finally_pulls_vlc_app_over_gpl_violations
Thank you for sharing your knowledge. I found your article interesting and summarizes the situation perfectly. Very happy to have read this information. Again thank you and good luck.
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